The Strange Universe Of Butterdezillion (Or, All Mimsy Were The Borogoves)

WARNING! Trying To Untangle One Of Butterdezillion’s Arguments Can Be Hazardous To Your Health!!!

Well, I have been putting this chore off for quite a while. I wanted to write something about Birther Butterdezillion  before, but to be honest, I was  just scared to death to start in on one of her arguments. The few times in the past when I attempted to untangle whatever point she was trying to make,  the effort ended in frustration, tears, and clumps of hair laying about the room.

I finally figured out this was because I was trying to discover where her logic had broken down.  But, that requires that you have some sort of logical trail to follow in the first place. With Butterdezillion, there is no “logic” or “consistency” as we know those concepts here on Planet Earth.  And, I do not mean this in a negative sense.

I am convinced that Butterdezillion’s Mind  partially resides in some other weird dimension where Time, Space, and Causality dance to the beat of different drummers. In her Universe, Alpha does not necessarily precede Omega. If does not precede then,  but instead, follows then. At least sometimes, because if if consistently followed then, then you could develop some sort of system to approach her work.  But for her, patterns seem to come and go randomly.

Much like Einstein back in the day, there are very few people on this Planet who can even conceive of what she is talking about, and most of those are institutionalized. I think when someone tries to follow her arguments, their axon and neurons and synapses begin to reconnect in strange ways never meant for humans. Play her games long enough and weird Lovecraftian shapes, with tentacles, start floating through the walls and ceilings.

Several weeks ago, before I tackled this project, I tried an experiment.  I remembered seeing an old Twilight Zone episode, where a little girl falls through an inter-dimensional hole behind her bed. She can’t find her way back.  Her father can hear her but not find her.  So, he calls a friend, and together they find the hole. However, when the men popped their heads through the hole it was like down was up, and then sideways, and then things moving left were really moving right.  Anyone entering the hole would be lost. So, one of the men tied a rope to the other, and went through the opening.  Her little dog, operating on some instinctual directional impulse, was able to find the child and guide her back to the hole, where  they all got pulled out just before the hole closed up.

This got me to thinking. Sooo,  I borrowed my mother’s  Shih Tzu, Gilbert, and tied a 25 foot electrical cord to his collar and began reading a Butterdezillion blog to him.  I put plugs in my ears so that one of us could stay in this dimension and operate the cord.  I tried to convince Gilbert to poke his nose up against the computer screen, but he did not seem to be interested in this at all. Although he did lick the screen once or twice.  But nothing apparently happened, so I took him home.

The next day my mother called and asked what I had done to Gilbert. She said he started having epileptic seizures and she had to rush him to the vet, who gave her some doggie Valiums.  For the dog, not her. Now whenever Gilbert starts seizing, she pops a half valium in his mouth and he calms right down.  I can’t prove this had anything to do with my experiment, but I do find this indirect confirmation that one should approach Butterdezillion’s writings with respect and caution.

Sooo, I am preparing by drinking some Franzia White Zinfadel wine and two Jager/Red Bull bombs, and then diving in. I figure the liquor will lubricate the axons and synapses so they can more easily slide back into shape when I return. I am also tying one end of the 25 foot electrical cord around my waist and the other end to a very heavy armoire so I can rappel myself back into this dimension.  Sooo, Here Goes!

First, here is Butterdezillion’s latest creation:

http://butterdezillion.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/wheel-of-fortune-v-family-feud-final.pdf

and here is a pdf of it, in case that becomes un-linked or her whole blog slides off into the 11th Dimension:

Butterdezillion’s Wheel Of Fortune v. Family Feud

Now the whole point of her post is that the recent verification of Obama birth certificate information by Hawaiian Alvin Onaka to Arizonian Ken Barnett doesn’t actually verify the information, but instead indirectly confirms that  the birth certificate information is either false or the whole birth certificate is legally invalid.

Here are the 3 documents that Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett sent to Hawaii. First is the “Form” request for verification, with 6 blocks of information filled in: (Click on all images to enlarge.)

Notice that this is a FORM request for a Certified Copy of Birth Record that has been hand modified into a Request for Verification In Lieu of Certified Copy. As part of filling out the form, there are six pieces of REQUIRED information that have been typed in relating to the actual Birth Record: (1) Name on Certificate (2) A block for Sex (3) Date of Birth (4) Place of Birth (5) Father’s Name  (6) Mother’s Name . There are other blocks that are filled in relating to administrative matters, such as the Name of Requestor and Address of Requestor.

Next is his Supplemental Request:

Ken Bennett wants Verification of 10 other pieces of information in addition to the six items on the above form, and verification of the birth certificate copy he attached.

And finally, since both Bennett’s and Onaka mention it was attached, a copy of Obama’s birth certificate:

Both Bennett and Onaka call the document attached to the Request, the “Certificate of Live Birth.”  The short form is called a “Certification of Live Birth”, so we can reasonably assume that the above document is the one attached to the Request.

In Response to these three items, Onaka provides:

Notice that Onaka verifies the long form birth certificate in its entirety; the 10 pieces of information on the supplemental request by specifically typing them out; AND certifies the “facts of the vital event.”

And, from page 1 of her Internet Article, here is the applicable Hawaiian law on the process of Verification:

§338-14.3 Verification in lieu of a certified copy. (a) Subject to the requirements of section 338-18, the department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.

(b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

Now, to a normal person reading this on Planet earth, it looks like Onaka just verified everything on the long form, which includes everything on the Request for Verification and the Supplemental Request. Additionally, Onaka specifically verifies the 10 pieces of information on the Supplemental Request. Finally, Onaka certifies the facts of the vital event, which were typed in the Request for Verification, and which occur in the exact same fashion on the long form attachment.

According to the law cited by Butterdezillion (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.  Well, the applicant was Ken Bennett, and the 6 facts he stated were  (1) Name on Certificate; (2) A block for Sex, Male; (3) Date of Birth; (4) Place of Birth; (5) Father’s Name; and  (6) Mother’s Name.

By her own recital of law, the act of Verification is also certification of the above 6 facts stated by the applicant . Yet, Butterdezillion is neither happy nor convinced. The Verification of Birth, and the certification and verification of the facts of birth, simply do not agree with her preconceived notions.  And what is the source of her discontent???

It is this. Onaka did not specifically list the 6 facts above along with the 10 items on the form Request for Verification. It matters not to her that Onaka certified and verified the whole damn long form, which includes all that information. It matters not that Onaka specifically verified the hospital as the Kapiolani  Maternity and Gynecological Hospital. Perhaps in her wormhole universe, there is another Kapiolani Hospital in Mombasa, Kenya???

It matters not to Butterdezillion that Onaka included 2 more items in his specific verification, those being that a birth certificate is on file showing that Barack Hussein Obama, II was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. And this is really the only fact on the Birth Certificate that matters. Being born in Hawaii makes him a natural born citizen, end of story. Who really cares, as a political matter, who his father is outside of The National Enquirer and World Net Daily???  Finally, it matters not to her that Bennett, the applicant, stated 6 facts in his Request, and got a Verification, and that the:

A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

In Butterdezillion Dimension, not only is this not a verification, it is indirect confirmation that the birth certificate is legally invalid. Let’s put on our ropes and slip into her dimension for a moment:

On Wheel of Fortune contestants take turns guessing what letters are in a mystery word or phrase. If a guess is correct, all the tiles having that letter light up, Vanna flips the tiles to show the letters, and the contestant is closer to solving the puzzle.

That’s also how a Hawaii verification of birth works too. An applicant fills out a form, “guessing” the true facts of a person’s birth, and the HI registrar writes back verifying as true whichever “guesses” match what is on a legally-valid record. If the lights don’t go off on a particular “guess” it’s either because it doesn’t match the record or because the record it matches isn’t legally valid so the true birth facts cannot be legally known. The statute does not allow discretion for the Department of Health to simply ignore some items that were requested to be verified (emphasis mine):

Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett filled out that web form (Exhibit A, attached at end of this report or all exhibits can be seen here) guessing that Barack Hussein Obama II’s true birth facts are what Obama’s posted birth certificate claims: gender = male; date of birth = Aug 4, 1961; city of birth = Honolulu, HI; island of birth = Oahu; mother = Stanley Ann (Dunham) Obama; father = Barack Hussein Obama.

HI State Registrar Alvin Onaka sent back a letter (Exhibit C) verifying that they have a birth certificate for Obama, but the lights didn’t go off for any of those birth facts Bennett guessed on the application. In an attached additional request (Exhibit B) Bennett asked Onaka to verify that an attached copy of Obama’s posted long-form was a “true and accurate representation of the original record on file”. Onaka wouldn’t verify that either but did verify that the birth facts claimed on the posted long-form matched the birth facts claimed on the original record at the HDOH.

Even though the claims matched, none could be verified as the true facts because the record on file is not legally valid. That is the logical conclusion. Dr. Onaka indirectly confirmed that Obama’s birth record is not legally valid.

Maybe I have been “in” too long, but I get the Wheel of Fortune analogy.  But what happens on Wheel of Fortune when you guess the hidden phrase??? Vanna turns over ALL the letters and YOU WIN!  Bennett got all the facts right, and his prize was THE VERIFICATION.  And just like the law says, [Onaka shall furnish] :

1.a verification of the existence of a certificate; and

2. [verification of] any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.

First, Bennett gets – 1. verification of the existence of a certificate :

Here in the first 2 items, Onaka provides the Verification of Birth, As Requested.

And then, Bennett gets – 2. [verification of] any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate:

Here is where Onaka verifies the other information that the Applicant provides to be verified.

So, Bennett got everything he asked for.  He even got verification of everything on the Birth Certificate. I can not understand how Onaka can verify the whole dang long form birth certificate, and Birthers still think that something is fishy. What more could you possibly verify as being consistent with the records???  But I think I know what Butterdezillion expected and how it differed from what Bennett got. Here is what he got:

Here is what Bennett got.

And here is what Butterdezillion expected;

Here is what Butterdezillion expected.

Darn, is that a Smiley Face??? Anyway, time to leave Butterdezillion Dimension. If I start having seizures, somebody call my mother. I am sure Gilbert will share his stash with me.

Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter

Note 1. The Image. This is a construct made from Edvard Munch’s Ashes, which I found at this website which contains many very beautiful images of Knots In Art. Mathematicians take note!:

http://etacar.put.poznan.pl/piotr.pieranski//KnotsInArt.html

Note 2. All Mimsy Were The Borogoves.  I stumbled across this while researching nonsense language from Alice in Wonderland.  From Wiki:

Mimsy Were the Borogoves” is a science fiction short story by Lewis Padgett (a pseudonym of Henry Kuttner and C. L. Moore) that was originally published in the February 1943 issue of Astounding Science Fiction Magazine.[1] It was judged by the Science Fiction Writers of America to be among the best science fiction stories written prior to 1965 and included in the anthology The Science Fiction Hall of Fame Volume One, 1929-1964. In 2007, it was loosely adapted into a feature-length film titled The Last Mimzy.

Millions of years in the future, a post-human scientist experimenting with a time machine sends two boxes with hastily gathered batches of educational toys into the past. The first arrives in the middle of the twentieth century and the second in the latter part of the nineteenth century. Believing the experiment to be a failure when the machines and test objects fail to return, he discontinues his efforts.

The first box of toys travels back to 1942, and is discovered by a seven-year-old boy, Scott Paradine, who takes it home. The toys include a small transparent cube that visibly manifests the holder’s thoughts; a wire maze puzzle employing a fourth dimension; and a detailed anatomical doll that possesses unfamiliar organs and structures. As Scott and his two-year-old sister Emma play with the toys, the psychology of the two develops in unusual ways.

Although their parents are often preoccupied with their own lives, they suspect an anomaly and become worried. They consult with a child psychologist, Rex Holloway, who quickly recognizes the strangeness of the toys, and suspects their origin to be alien. Holloway surmises that the toys are “educating” the children and introducing an “x factor” into Scott’s and Emma’s thought processes. He believes their developing minds are pliable enough to be profoundly affected by the devices.

The toys rapidly guide the Paradine children to construct a pathway into the dimension where the beings of the future live. At Holloway’s direction their parents take the toys away from them; but the children continue their effort.

You sooo have to read the rest of this!!! It fits right in with the Motif:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimsy_Were_the_Borogoves

Note 3. Link.  Here is the link to Butterdezillion’s Blog:

http://butterdezillion.wordpress.com/

About Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

Hi!!! I am a Girl Reporter on the Internet. I am 29. Plus I am a INTP. I have a Major in Human Kinetics, and a Minor in English. I have 2 cats, and a poor little orphan Blue Jay named Squawky. I write poetry, and plus I am trying to learn how to play guitar. I think that is all??? Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter View all posts by Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

39 responses to “The Strange Universe Of Butterdezillion (Or, All Mimsy Were The Borogoves)

  • G

    Another excellent post. I won’t bother wasting words on BZ (as I call Butterdezillion), because brains like hers are so broken, that there is no point arguing against gibbering gibberish.

    But I do want to hand out the KUDOS award for the very entertaining tale, that provides such clever and apropo metaphors for what attempting such an endeavor is like.

    First of all, thanks for the info in Note 2 about “Mimsy Were The Borogoves” – I did not realize that it was an actual short story (I’ll have to track it down to get the full satisfying read someday) and only knew it from the unforgettable Jabberwocky tale in Alice In Wonderland. Let’s just say it fits your analogy on BOTH accounts!!

    Second, another Kudos for the Lovecraftian reference (one of my favorite authors): “Play her games long enough and weird Lovecraftian shapes, with tentacles, start floating through the walls and ceilings”. While that can fit many Lovecraftian stories in general, the allusion best fits his “From Beyond” tale. It was also made into a really good Lovecraftian movie. Again, it ties in perfectly to your analogy.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_Beyond_(short_story)

    Speaking of Lovecraftian themes and movies, BZ’s babble brings “In the Mouth of Madness” to mind (in more ways than one)…which makes me think of actor Sam Neill…which makes me think of another one of his movies that seems to describe the crazed fevered hellscape that delusional paranoid Birthers, such as BZ and others seem to live in, within their own heads – “Event Horizon”.

    Finally, all I can say about BZ’s lame “Wheel of Fortune” reference is that in her mind, she doesn’t actually “get” our world’s “Wheel of Fortune”. Her brain only perceives “Wheel of Fucked Up”… which pretty much sums up the Birther thought process in a nutshell…

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      G:

      Thank God you read this Internet Article!!! I was sooo afraid nobody would read anything about Butterdezillion for fear their brains would dissolve or something. In some ways, BZ is the scariest Birther of all, because you just know something is not right there. Old cartographers would have labeled her, “Here there be WTF???”

      That science fiction story surprised me too, I was going to use the “All mimsy” language, but I thought I better look it up first to make sure that it didn’t really mean something.

      I am glad that you liked it. For what it’s worth, there really is a Gilbert, and he really does have small seizures. He is the apple of my mother’s eye, and for a dog, he is special. He would come over more often, but my cats intimidate him.

      My mom is afraid to let him outside without her being there because we have owls, hawks, and even eagles (sometimes) around.

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

      • G

        Sorry to hear about Gilbert’s seizures…but glad he’s real.

        …unlike anything BZ claims, which only makes it up to even surreal on her best days…

        Also – great reference to “Here there be dragons” BTW… ;)

        One final comment – the “spaghetti ball” in the image makes me think of the FSM… which is a more plausible (and much more fun) mythology than Birtherism, by far! ;)

  • linda

    I have seen birthers claim that the Verification wasn’t a true verification or didn’t really say what it seemed to say. I still don’t understand why they think that, but now I know where it came from. Thanks. You make it back okay?

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      Hi Linda!!!

      I think I made it back OK. I am drinking more Franzia White Zinfadel Wine to make sure everything falls back into place. I am tired, but I am kind of afraid to go to sleep just yet. I don’t want those brain cells shutting down until I am good and past Butterdezillion Land.

      Thank you for asking!!!

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

    • G

      Simple answer Linda – they are completely incapable of accepting anything that pokes a bubble in their pre-conceived delusions. It is called wilful denialism and cognitive dissonance…

      Or just image the old image of three monkeys doing the “see no evil, hear no evil…” skit…but replace “evil” with “truth” and you’ve got the Birther mindset right there.

      Or imagine an osterich with its head in the sand…

      …etc, etc. I think you get the point.

  • The Magic M

    Oh darn, now I will always think of birthers digging for dirt when I read “and the mome raths outgrabe”. ;)

    I think the whole issue of birther delusion about these “non-verifying verifications” is that they somehow believe Onaka would not just have had to say “matches what we have on file” but also “and what we have on file is true”.
    But if he had, they’d just have gone “how can he verify that, he has no personal knowledge”.

    I have always predicted that at some point, birthers would have to go for “even if the BC is real, how can we be sure the information on it isn’t a lie?”. It’s their last resort, basically. “The registrar lied, or was using false information fed to him, when he typed the BC.”
    Which conveniently (for every conspiracy) allows to ignore ANY evidence at all because who really can say if any document contains the truth or a lie?
    Butterdezillion herself might have been born in France to totally different parents and was simply lied to all her life. And of course all her papers are just lies, too. ;)

    • The Magic M

      > But if he had, they’d just have gone “how can he verify that, he has no personal knowledge”.

      We’ve seen this with the NBC issue. First birthers complained that Hawaii never said Obama was an NBC, and when Hawaii did, birthers did a 180 and said “how can they verify that, it’s not up to them to decide that?”. Catch-22, the birthers’ favourite game…

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      Hi MagicM!!!

      Call me paranoid, but sometimes I think their game is to take anything which seriously hurts their cause, and then get somebody to write tons of drivel which people won’t read. Because it weighs a “ton.”

      And if they did read it, they couldn’t make any sense out of it. Because it is “drivel.”

      Then they can say whatever they want, and if you disagree, you get, for example, “But Butterdezillion proved it was never verified!” And like who wants to destroy their own brain reading her stuff.

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

  • RoadScholar

    That thing in the foreground looks like an egg laid by Cthulhu after being groped by the noodly appendage of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

    Wait… What’s that gurgling sound?!!

  • Verbalobe

    So brave of you! Kudos!

    Here’s the part I keep coming back to:

    “If the lights don’t go off on a particular “guess” it’s either because it doesn’t match the record or because the record it matches isn’t legally valid so the true birth facts cannot be legally known.” (My emphasis, if the italic tags work.)

    AFAIK she has never provided any citation or reference for this assertion. Where did she get the idea that state vital records custodians carefully confirm, file, and maintain BOTH “true birth facts” AND “not legally valid” data???

    If it is maintained by the state registrar, it is a true fact. What else is there???

    Well, other than in the 11th dimension that is.

    Stay safe.

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      Hi Verbalobe!!!

      You are sooo right. Nearly everything she writes has weird stuff like that buried all throughout it. That is why it is so hard to follow her arguments. She just IMAGINES this kind of stuff into this sphere of Reality.

      You could imagine in her Mind, that there is a True Birth Records File Cabinet, and then over there in a corner somewhere, sits a sinister False Birth Records File Cabinet. And a separate set of laws to cover each. Except they are really the same laws, unless you know which file cabinet is used.

      She is just frigging “out there.” But my goodness, she is a prominent Birther. People believe her!

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

  • roadburner

    excuse the off-topic bit, but it seems susan daniels has just had the wrath of the empty chair sprung upon her.

    we´ve got a week for the judges decision, and i believe we can anticipate another victoy for ikea

  • Reality Check

    Squeeky

    Thanks for going into the deep, dark, spooky place called Butterdizillion so we do not have too. I was trying to think of some appropriate game show analogies for BD and the best I could do on short notice was “The Joker’s Wild”.

  • Monkey Boy

    Is Yulia prescient?

    A comment from Orly’s septic tank of virus, trojans and lunacy.

    Why? Sheriff Arpaio made a deal with the Department of Justice. They won’t prosecute him and, in return, he won’t testify.
    Maybe if Dr. Taitz filed a case in Maricopa County, Sheriff Arpaio would not be able to dodge an out of state subpoena. Plus she would get a jury of 12 Arizonans!!!
    Once Sheriff Joe testifies, it’s all over. Dr. Taitz can then pack her bags once she’s nominated to the Supreme Court.
    Like the saying goes: If Mohammed will not go to the mountain, the mountain must come to Mohammed. Even if Dr. Taitz does not file a case in Arizona, she can always get any court’s permission to take Joe’s deposition in Maricopa County. That’s only 1 hour flight from LA.

    You are going to luv Sing Sing, Squeeks.

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      Yulia:

      You can just run back to Orly Taitz and tell her all about the new Internet Article I just did on her. She will never find my Flying Monkey spy!!!

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

    • Rambo_Ike

      How cute! Whenever I come here to see the latest lunacy on Squeeky’s blog I always see the G-string & Boy Monkey posting together, like in “one mind”. Reminds me of the lyrics in the Phil Collins song:

      “Two hearts beating in just 1 mind, canoodling together till the end of time”

      For what it’s worth, which is useless when trying to communicate with common sense to an Obot: You can’t verify a document/record without having the original to compare it to.

      Oh yeah, that’s right. Somebody told you so. You all are funny.

      • Slartibartfast

        Ikey,

        The truth, which no birther will acknowledge, is that, according to the Constitution, the ultimate authority as to who was born in Hawai’i is the Hawai’ian Department of Health. Director Fuddy gets the final word on this topic in any US court—including the SCOTUS—and she says President Obama was born there. End of story (except for bigots willing to lie if it will smear the lawful President of the United States…).

      • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

        Hi Rambo Ike!!!

        Well, I am glad that you stop by here because it is always good to hear from “The Other Side.” On the verification, Alvin Onaka does have access to the “original” and since he also verified EVERYTHING on the long form (43 pieces of information), then it is very likely he looked up the original.

        Remember the “short form” only has limited information which is in the data base. They had to go down to the Vault to make Obama’s copies for him on the long form.

        Squeeky Fromm
        Girl Reporter.

        • Monkey Boy

          Yes, it’s good to have Twinky here for sport and amusement. Whenever doofus Dave runs off with his tail between his legs to get some new talking point, it gets boring.

          All sensible people agreeing doesn’t get the adrenalin flowing.

        • Jimmy

          Hi Squeaky !
          Do you have any idea why the President doesn’t tell Onaka to bring in an investigator to get more eyes on it?
          I realize Onaka is the authority but it would change the dynamic, no?
          Oh and why doesn’t the President release more info?
          I realize you don’t know everything and opinions are like underwear but why would Onaka want millions of people to take Onaka’s word for everything?

      • G

        “For what it’s worth, which is useless when trying to communicate with common sense to an Obot: You can’t verify a document/record without having the original to compare it to.”

        Well that’s funny. THAT happens to be the point that our side has been trying to tell you loser Birther fools all along in regards to your wasted wild goose chase over PDFs.

        And the original HAS been verified – repeatedly – by the OFFICIAL HI authorities in charge of it. So boo-hoo to you, you loose again.

        In regards to the rest of your latest weird little tantrum, I don’t know what to tell you. If you are insinuating that Monkey Boy and I are somehow one and the same, or even coordinating…

        …well, then as usual, you are sadly mistaken and delusional. While I enjoy his posts, our writing styles are nothing alike and our points on this forum often address very different aspects. There is simply no connection nor coordination there, sorry.

      • Monkey Boy

        Oh, Twinky, you birther scoundrels ALWAYS project your own failings to others.

        Come out of the closet and tell tea-tards of your “inner self” if you dare. I know…that would cause you listenership to dwindle, but be true to thine own self and you can MAKE A MARK!

        Yes, that was a pun.

      • Northland10

        If it is important to compare a document with the original to see if it is valid, does that mean that we should compare the document showing Obama was born elsewhere with the original that states he was born elsewhere? Hmm.. you appear to be missing both the document and the original that shows he was born elsewhere.

        I think this means that Onaka wins since his verification of the document beats, well, a big nothing.

        I am feeling a bit down today as Pambo chose to insult others besides me. Makes me feel like I should go eat some creamed fish.

  • mnskeptic

    I can’t believe you took a serious look at Butterdezillion! Her reasoning makes my head hurt. I thought Apuzzo was nuts, but she’s a whole magnitude nuttier than he is! BTW, kudos for you for taking on the Putz too.

    Looking at your artwork and thinking about the birthers made me think of M.C. Escher. Have you seen his work? I think his Relativity might be a good analogy for birther logic.

    • Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

      Hi mnskeptic!!!

      I wiki’d it to see, and yes I have seen the picture, but I never knew about the gravity well stuff. That adds a whole new aspect to it. I used an Escher print in one of my Internet Articles, but it was last year. It was the two heads unwrapping with each other, but I forget the name of the post. I will try to find it.

      I really like Art, and especially pre-Raphaelites, the Surrealists, and black and white photography. I try to work as much of that in as I can.

      Oh yes, on the “head hurting” Butterdezillion stuff, I was really lucky to find that Munch painting with the people holding their heads.

      Squeeky Fromm
      Girl Reporter

  • BrianH

    Excellent article. I might have been reluctant to add comments 3 months afterward, but even post-election stupid Birther arguments persist. Since “how can a document be ‘forged’ when the information has been verified as true?” is still the best rejoinder to those who think the CCP actually did som ething, buttressing the Hawaii verification may still be worthwhile.

    BDZ gets off-track in the same way many Birther arguments do: creation of sub-categories and distinctions that aren’t seen by the rest of sentient human beings. (I loved your “Mimsy” comparison). The specific error BDZ makes is seen here:

    Bennett additionally requested that Onaka “please verify the following items from the record of birth” (file #, time of birth, hospital, etc). That could be interpreted to mean either “verify as legally true” or “verify that these claims are ON the record of birth”.

    There is no “either” here. Nothing in the Hawaii Statute speaks of something being verfiied as “legally true” (aside from the matter of what she means by that term). The statute only speaks of verification of factual claims the applicant submits (her second category). BDZ invents the first category in an attempt to create an “argument from silence” toward her “indirect verification” silliness.

    Anyone with a legal background will understand that a fact witness (like the person attesting vital records information) cannot testify on a question of law (here, the legal import of the facts). If by “legally true” BDZ means something like “attest to the probative value of the facts verified” (which comes closer to how a court might define it), then it’s not for Dr. Onaka to speak on that (and, to repeat, the statute does not require that to be stated). Though I suspect that what BDZ means by “legally valid” is closer to “epistemic certainty” (meaning that every original document has been examined and its bona fides have been established beyond all doubt). Since for the conspiratorially-minded person like BDZ such proof is impossible (since Hawaii is already in on the conspiracy and since even ‘independent’ voices (like experts and judges) are soon silenced by these mysterious bogeymen who come in the night), it’s a game of moving goalposts.

    • BrianH

      I should have added:

      The “legally valid” conclusion that follows the factual verification is set forth in the second sentence of the statute (as you’ve noted):

      (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

      1. SOS Bennett requested verification of a factual claim, i.e., that Barrack Obama II was born in Hawaii.
      2. Dr. Onaka verified that fact per the “original record” (his wording; not “amended” or “superseded” record or anything like that mentioned) of the State of Hawaii.
      3. By statute, that verification is “for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur . . . as stated by the applicant.” So President Obama’s birth in Hawaii is thus established per the records of the State of Hawaii.
      4. Under the Constitution, each state is obligated to give full faith and credit to the “public acts [and] records” of every other state.

      Game, set and match as far as the question of President Obama’s U.S. birth goes.

      • RoadScholar

        Oh, sure, YOU know that. But that’s just because you, unlike Birthers, have a working Central Nervous System and walk upright.

        Actually, I’d bet Steven Hawking would quickly grasp that BHO is eligible, so you don’t even need to be ambulatory.

        I can hear his synthesized voice now:

        “No material in the known universe– not the heart of a neutron star, not the horrific density of a black hole, nothing we have yet seen with our instruments or imagined in our calculations– is as unnaturally impenetrable as the skull of a Birther.”

        • BrianH

          Hah! I love it.

          But that still leads me to wonder if it’s possible to penetrate the Birther skull by using Birther matter. Kinda like how Mr. Incredible did to destroy the indestructible machine. Is the Birther skull divisible? Can Birther-think be reversed in polarity to fire back and penetrate itself?

          There are so many questions as one explores the alter-universe.

        • G

          The only thing that can save a Birther is for they themselves to give up clinging to their own internal irrational fears and hate.

          They either will eventually get tired of being wrongheadede angry assholes all the time or they will eventually die pathetic and miserable. That is all up to themselves.

          They really have no tether to external reality that they accept, unless it feeds their foolish sick fetishes. So sadly, call me cynical, but I don’t see how those that are still Birthers are reachable at all, because they don’t accept rationality nor reasonableness.

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